62. Let Go of Your Religious Trauma (with Eric Feltes)

Snarky Opener (0:00)

Eric Feltes

Every journey is different, but it all involves becoming resilient of that shame, daring to desire, and daring to take up the space that we are worthy of taking up.

Episode Introduction (0:29)

Rob Loveless

Hello my LGBTQuties, and welcome back to another episode of A Jaded Gay.

I'm Rob Loveless and, today, I am a non-jaded gay because I had to go to the DMV to get my license renewed, which I know that might sound like an oxymoron.

Going to the DMV equals me being a non-jaded gay? But I was in and out.

I got up at the crack of dawn, got there right at 8:30 when they opened, went right in, and within five minutes, got my license and left.

Now the only downside is, I am not a big fan of my license photo. I definitely liked my older license photo better, but you can't win them all.

Religious Trauma (1:00)

Rob Loveless

Anyway, I am super excited because today we have a very special VIP guest joining us to talk about unbecoming shame and trauma we've experienced as gay men. And we will get into that shortly. But first, you know the drill, tarot time.

Tarot (1:18)

Rob Loveless

So, you might get a little bit of deja vu because today's card is The Hermit in reverse, which we just pulled a few weeks ago. I believe in the Judy Garland episode.

So, some of this might sound familiar, but it's what the universe sent us for today. So, as you remember, The Hermit is number nine in the Major Arcana, and nine means we're nearing the end of a cycle.

And in astrology, it's tied to Virgo, which is very analytical and hard-working. And circling back to the number nine in numerology, when we are nearing the end of a cycle, we may find a sense of solitude in that.

However, when we pull this card in reverse, it's telling us one of two things: we're either not taking enough time for personal reflection, or we're taking too much time for personal reflection and isolating ourselves as a result.

And it can also indicate that we're struggling to connect with our spiritual self. And it's no surprise because, looking inward, it can be really uncomfortable.

I mean, we may be confronted with some truths we don't know how to handle, and we may even have to learn or unlearn some aspects about ourselves.

So, this card is telling us that if we're not taking the time to look inward, we need to start making that time to do so, even if it's uncomfortable.

Because the work we're doing will help us get to a happier tomorrow. Or if we're focusing too much internally, we need to start branching out and reconnect with our support systems and chosen family.

So definitely some food for thought as we go through today's episode.

Guest Introduction (2:31)

Rob Loveless

And with that, I'd like to introduce our guest. He is an actor, writer, and plant daddy, and recently launched his podcast The Great Unbecoming. Please welcome Eric Feltes.

Eric Feltes

Thanks for having me, Rob. I'm happy to be here.

Rob Loveless

Congrats on the podcast. I know you just launched it last week, so I've been enjoying that, loving every episode.

Eric Feltes

Thank you so much. It's been such a journey.

We got several episodes lined up already, and it's I'm really happy with how it's being received, and it's just a great excuse to be able to connect with people. I'm sure you know as a podcaster, yourself.

Rob Loveless

Definitely. And I can't wait to share the news of that with everybody on this episode. But before we get into that, can you just tell us a little bit about yourself, how you identify, all that fun stuff?

Eric Feltes

Yeah, absolutely sure. My name is Eric Feltes. My pronouns are he/him. I am a gay, cisgender male life coach. I help other gay, bi, trans men free themselves from church shame.

I live in Los Angeles. I'm also an actor, and as as Rob said, I'm a podcaster. My podcast is The Great Unbecoming. It's stories of unlearning, of letting go of what no longer serves you to become the person that you have always been meant to be.

And, yeah, I've sort of always been in the business of people with acting and podcasting and life coaching. I just love working with people.

So, opportunities like this to connect with you is totally up my alley. I love it.

Rob Loveless

And when I was looking, doing a little research beforehand, I saw you were actually in an episode of Shameless?

Eric Feltes

Yeah. It's so funny you said that because the person who turned me onto your podcast is a new client of mine, and he found me.

After he found me, he did some research, and he, one of the first things he said to me was that I was also on Shameless, and he had just finished the whole the whole series.

So, he's like, this is a sign. I need to sign up for your program now. Because he's like, that's the straw that broke the camel's back. I'm actually, I have a mask on.

I'm in the absolute last episode, though. So, I'm in the last episode of the last season.

It was a lot of fun, and which was really cool because it was also the last scene that the two bar regulars, if you know the show, are there. They always sit at the bar, they always have quippy comments.

It was their last scene that we shot, so it's really emotional for everyone on set. And it was also the last scene that was ever to be recorded in that bar. So that that made it really special.

Rob Loveless

Oh, wow, that's awesome. Yeah, I'm a big fan of Shameless, so I binged the last season when it came out.

So, I'll have to go back and re-watch it because it's one of those shows that like you watch it so fast, everything kind of blurs together.

Eric Feltes

Oh sure. 100%.

Eric’s Career (5:05)

Rob Loveless

Well, going off of that, can you tell us a little bit about your career journey from Spanish and theater teacher to actor and writer to life coach?

Eric Feltes

Yeah, absolutely. So, like I said, I've always been in the business of people, and I've always loved working with people. I when I was in college, I thought I wanted to be an actor.

However, I was in the closet, and I think that subconsciously, maybe semi-consciously, I just thought I couldn't do that.

I thought I couldn't, I couldn't be an authentic actor if I wasn't being an authentic human. It just didn't feel safe for me at that time.

So, I minored in theater, but I double majored in education, Spanish, which I absolutely loved, you know, like I said, it's still people. I studied abroad for a year. I loved learning a new language.

I loved learning different cultures. And I'll say, a huge gift for me, and I do know this comes from a place of privilege.

Not everyone has the means to do this, but to be able to study abroad for a year really helped me, you know, as a 19-year-old, to understand my own privilege because here I was in different countries, struggling with their language, and not just, you know, was so fun about studying abroad in Spain is that, you know, I used to live right outside Chicago, so like, traveling from like Barcelona to Paris was about the same to travel from like Chicago to Iowa.

You know what I mean? And nothing wrong with Iowa, but like, you get so much more culture for, you get much more bang for your buck when it comes to culture, right? So, I was able to study abroad.

Spain and Argentina, and particularly when I was in Europe, I went almost every other weekend to just a different country. It was so wonderful.

And so, I struggled with languages, I struggled with embarrassment and different culture, different cultures, and not feeling like an outsider, right? And oftentimes traveling alone.

I can't believe I did that at that age, but I felt fearless at the time, but, you know, feeling lonely at times, and it in my white, cisgender male, at that time, straight-identified body, you know, I had so much privilege, and so it wasn't.

It was a nice check for me to realize what it's like to be a little othered. There's a huge gift. And I loved Spanish.

I still do, so I taught for about four and a half years after college and and I also directed the musical. The fall play and the musical. And then after I came out of the closet when I was 25, I was still teaching.

That was sort of the drop in the bucket and the ripple effect, it was massive. So, I started questioning everything. If I was living, you know, I was engaged to a woman at the time.

If I was living this quote-unquote straight life, really, for other people, then, then what else was I doing for other people? And I realized that I really did want to be an actor.

So, I, after a couple more years of teaching, at that point, I moved to Chicago when I was about 27 to pursue acting, and yeah. I was a substitute teacher.

That's kind of how I paid the bills as I was pursuing acting, and I always knew Chicago would be sort of a stepping stone. I knew that LA was gonna be my final destination.

So, I moved to LA. Substitute teaching was not paying the bills in LA. It paid the bills in Chicago. Chicago is a little easier to live off of. The cost of living is a little lower. LA is so expensive.

So that just wasn't working. So, then I became a property manager, and I hated it. It was such a miserable job.

I did that for about five years, and while pursuing acting, which I'm still doing, and I remember thinking that I was just normalizing misery.

So, I ended up getting into coaching, and that was a situation where the stars just sort of aligned for me. So many factors. I had a friend who was one of my tenants, who was also a gay male life coach, so he sort of introduced me to that possibility.

I started creating content because, as an actor, I wanted to create more content.

And I made this one video where I call it Gay God, where I pretended to be, you know, this very cliche version of God, and like the Santa Claus beard and hair and this white robe and and I said, yes, I'm gay.

Yes, I'm God, yes, I'm gay. Get over it, because, you know, if my children are gay, I said that you're made in the image and likeness of me. So, if you're gay, then I clearly, I'm gay.

And I was so naive, I didn't realize that that could fall on the wrong side of of the tracks on TikTok, which it did.

About six months after making that video, I started getting, it blew up, and I would get 100 or 100 or more comments a day.

You're going to hell. How dare you. Don't disrespect my God. Leviticus 18:22, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

And the thing is, is that I identify as a Christian as well. Not one that feels you need to believe in Jesus to get to heaven, not because I don't think that's what Jesus believed.

I'm a Christian, from the standpoint of, I want to follow Christ, not worship Christ because Jesus never said first of all, I also don't think the word Christ is universal to Jesus, but that's another conversation.

I believe the point, just like any other religion is to inspire you to love, period. And so, it was so shocking to me that so many people were so hateful.

So, meeting the life coach, being miserable in my current job, praying, crying to God. What is my purpose in life? So often, I call it prayer. You might call it manifestation. It doesn't matter. It's the same.

It's putting energy towards a question. The question was, what the heck is my purpose? Why am I on this planet? Because acting isn't working, and I'm still gonna wait, but I'm not gonna wait forever.

I'm not a victim, right? Like, I'm not gonna sit around and wait for things to happen for me. There's only so much in your control, right? I want to make a difference in the world, and I have so much to give.

So, all of these things came together, and then I realized, oh, wow, I can put this all together, and all of my gifts really do align. I make videos which I think are good, and I think come from my acting experience.

I have used my trauma of being burned by the church, myself, of wishing that I was on a lie for being gay, of of so badly, going hard in such a challenging way, going from hating being gay to tolerating it to getting to a place where I love and celebrate it.

And seeing all these comments made me realize, oh, they're purging their hatred onto me, but also, they're bullying other people in their own lives.

This is needed work. So instead of being a life coach that can help everyone because a confused mind, says, No. If you're a life coach that says, I can help everyone, your it's probably your business.

Is probably a hobby more than anything else. But if you're very specific with your niche, like I said, I help gay, bi, trans men free themselves from church shame, that's very specific. And and it worked out.

So, the stars aligned, and again, everything led up to this point, and now it just feels like it's, I feel so aligned, and I feel like my prayer has been answered of what my purpose is. I feel like I'm totally living in integrity and in my purpose.

Rob Loveless

I love that. And what you're saying with the kind of finding that niche audience, I think that's really important.

Balancing Sexuality with Religion (12:17)

Rob Loveless

Because I think sometimes in the gay world, it's, you know, you feel like you might be hated on, you know, quote-unquote hated on by Christians for being gay, and then also hated on by people in the gay community for being Christian.

Eric Feltes

Yes.

Rob Loveless

It could be really difficult balancing both.

So, I know you had mentioned you were engaged to a woman, and then struggling, you know, with your sexuality while, you know, or struggling to balance your sexuality with your, your Christian faith. Something I've kind of gone through as well.

I'm Catholic. I still go to Mass every weekend, but I actually kind of just stay in the back of the church to have my own reflection time, my own prayer, and then, you know, do tarot on the side when I'm home, but kind of balance it all.

But um, how, going off of that, how did you, I guess, come to terms with your sexuality and learn to balance, you know, your sexuality and your faith?

Eric Feltes

Yeah. You mentioned that you sit in the back and you, you you reflect, and you use that time, and that's beautiful. I love that you do that. I love that you found that.

I want to be very clear, y'all. My job as a coach is not to bring you to church. It's not to bring you out of church. It's not to bring you in the closet. It's not to bring you out of the closet.

My job as a coach, and I think the same as for Rob as a podcaster, is to, is to help you to love yourself deeply as you are in whatever vehicle that works for you.

So, I have had many people tell me I can't be, many Christians tell me I can't be gay. I've had many gay people tell me I can't be a Christian. That's that's absolute asinine.

This is what works for me, and it's a vehicle that I can use to help myself and to help others love themselves in the world around them. I also want to say, when people say there's no one like.

I can't tell you how many times people, Rob, tell me, oh, there's no one like me. There are no other gay Christians. I'm like, Hi, I'm here, and also, I'm one of the loud ones.

Rob is here. He sits in the back, and that's okay, and that works for him, right? So, there are many, many more quiet ones than there are loud ones. But we are.

There's many of us here, so I'm glad that you told us that. Thank you.

There was a moment in my life where I was struggling with deconstruction, and it was after I started my business, actually, and I had a panic attack, and I had this thought of like, what if there is no afterlife?

Period. I had come to the conclusion that I, that if there was a heaven and a hell, that I was going to heaven.

I just knew that in my heart, and I had struggled with, maybe there's not a hell, but I'm like, but there's something, right? So, for the first time in my life, I was like, what if there's nothing?

And that thought terrified me and sent me through this massive panic attack. And through the end of that, I remember sitting on the edge of the couch, and I was sobbing, and I heard.

I envisioned myself walking into the room, and this wasn't like a vision where, like, I could reach out and touch this person like.

But, but I, but I, but I sensed and I saw me, and I also knew at that moment that that version of me was Christ.

That's not to say that I'm God, but that's also to say that I'm God, but it's also to say that you're God. That we're all God, that that God is love.

And in this moment, personified by an image of me was, was, was love. That's what it was. It was Christ. It was universal Christ. And this version of me said, Eric, thank you for never giving up on me.

And I just broke down. I mean, I sobbed, and I said I would never give up on you, and to me because of the way I was brought up that was, that was Christ and and and also a form of Jesus.

Again, if I had been brought up Muslim, it probably wouldn't have been Jesus. You know what I'm saying?

Like it's not about...the words and images are very finite, but love is infinite, and love flows like water down to the deepest crevices imaginable.

So, I think that the universe, God, love whatever you want to, whatever you want to call it, chose, chose what I knew because of the stories that I knew. And that works for me, right? Does that make sense?

So, so in that moment of thank you for never giving up on me, I think they were saying that thank you for never giving up on Christianity.

Because I think that Christianity can be a source of love and can be a vehicle towards wholeness, and I think I can use that tool. I preach at the pulpit.

I preach my own story of how my queerness is next to godliness. And while the church is a symbol for so much pain and trauma for so many people, and I'm, I hate that, I I also know that we can transform it from within.

And again, I also respect people walking away from it. But through that experience, I recognized that the more I love my queerness, the more I feel seen and loved by Christ.

I had this image then, as I was sobbing, like, at this point, I was on the floor and my hands were like, like, on the couch. Like, I was, like, sobbing into the couch, and my knees were on the floor.

And I had this image of Jesus in Gethsemane the night before he was murdered, crying on a rock, saying, God, I don't want to do this. Don't make me do this, please. Begging. He was 33, he was so scared.

Let's remember that confidence is not... confidence is not the absence of fear. Confidence is the ability to hold fear and love at the same time.

So yes, Jesus was confident in his mission, but he was scared, and in that moment of deep despair for me, I felt as if I was able to so humanize Jesus.

I think the people that crucified Jesus 2000 years ago are the same people that use Jesus as a weapon against the queer community today. They don't know Jesus.

They don't know how to humanize Jesus because they haven't been able to humanize themselves. The deeper and richer you feel pain, the deeper and richer you can feel love.

And so, the more I have been able to fully love myself through all of that pain, through all of that trauma, the more I am able to feel so connected with my Christianity, which is the vehicle that I have been given, and to also choose to continue down my path of wholeheartedness.

Rob Loveless

I heard you say the word love quite a few times, which I really love hearing that because, you know, growing up well, at least for me, I feel, you know, Christianity, Catholicism, it's the basis of most religion, is love, compassion, kindness to each other, and we're taught that as we're younger, and then all of a sudden, when we get older, at least for me anyway, when I was younger, that's what I learned.

And then when I got older is when I hear, you know, oh, well, there's actually exceptions to that rule. And you know, growing up, you hear God loves you no matter what.

But then when you get older, you start hearing people saying, well, he loves you no matter what, as long as you abide to A, B, and C.

And I think it's kind of at least for me, what I've done is I've tried to separate the church as an organization versus, you know, what I view as God and the religion because people will interpret things how they want.

And it's, at least for me, the core foundation of that is love. And so that's what I'm trying to choose to believe for my own religion that might not align with the church's religion, if that makes sense.

Eric Feltes

Yeah. Well, then also we can separate, we can separate religion from spirituality, right?

Religion comes from the root word religos, which means bound, whereas spirituality comes from spirit, which means free.

Your relationship with your higher power is an individual, unique, specific relationship that no one else can understand, period. Period.

So, when we use things like the Bible as a rule book, we're binding them to earthly matters, to man-made laws, and that's not God. God is so much bigger than that.

Rob Loveless

I'm really glad that you were able to take those on personal experiences to channel into your business, and then to put that out there to help other gay men who are also maybe kind of struggling to balance, you know, their their sexuality and their religion.

The Power of Life Coaching (20:09)

Rob Loveless

So, and that leads us into The Great Unbecoming, which is, I believe, the life coaching program you set up first and then the podcast after. Is that correct?

Eric Feltes

Kind of, yeah. So, The Great Unbecoming is the name of the podcast, but that came after the program. So, I have a 10-week program called The Shame Free Gay Life program.

I do say the word gay. Gay, bi, trans people identify as male. So, The Great Unbecoming that the title came after, after the program.

And the reason is, is because I recognize that this, that what I'm doing with with these gay, bi, trans, non-binary men, is a universal process of learning how to radically love yourself.

And while I don't invite people outside of that category into the program, I think, I think for this community, I think it is important to have some sameness, and that sameness can be the same specific trauma as, as queer men that have been traumatized and burned by the church, right?

So, I think that that for that community aspect, I think that's important, but I do realize that the message is so much more universal than that, so I wanted to rebrand that in the podcast and make sort of the similar message to a much broader audience.

And what do the podcast and The Shame Free Gay Life program all have in common? They're all stories of unbecoming.

It's all letting go of that which no longer serves you in order to step into our own authenticity and become the people that we've always been meant to be.

Rob Loveless

And going to the program you're talking about, kind of two-fold question here. One, for people who might not be aware of what life coaching is, can you kind of give an overview of what they can expect?

And then two, specifically with the niche audience you're you're helping what, what could they expect from your program?

Eric Feltes

You know, I like to describe what what coaching is by by talking about what it's not. So, life coaching is not therapy. You know, differences are this. You know, therapy is great. I love therapy.

I've had wonderful therapists. Some of, some of the guys in my program that that have been through, or have therapy have done, that had been the most successful, therapy gives you a good foundation of mindfulness.

Therapy focuses much more on the past and how that affects your present, whereas coaching focuses more on your present and how that affects your future and sets you up for future success.

One thing I hear from a lot of people who come to me through therapy is that, you know, I know all of these things, but I don't know what to do with it.

So, it's kind of like therapy, kind of like gives you all of the pieces, you know, but I think coaching kind of helps you to put the pieces together. So that doesn't mean we don't dive into the past.

We dive into a lot of unresolved trauma, 100% but that's, that's a broad stroke definition.

Another one is that, because it mandates, you know, therapists can't share as much personal information about their personal lives as coaches can. And I think that works for therapy.

I think that's important. That's an important container for therapy. Coaching is different. No, I'm not your friend, but I'm also, there's not as much standing between us.

And so, with a field like ours, when we're dealing with shame, Brene Brown says that shame hates to have words wrapped around it.

And so, if you talk to me about a story of, you know, shame around sex, or a walk of shame or fear around dating, or fear around coming out to someone, or grief over the loss of someone who who doesn't want to be your friend because you came out, or your perfectionism or people pleasing, or whatever you're dealing with because of the shame.

I've been there. I've been in all of those dark places. I want to share personal stories of myself with my clients so that they feel as if they're not alone. Shame will tell you that you're alone and you're not.

And so unlike therapy, I can share those deep story, personal stories, with my clients. So that's another big difference.

But overall, you know, coaching is, I'll say it again, it takes you, it clarifies where you are, and sets you up for success in your future. In my program, every program is different, my program, we set goals.

There's a community aspect, so you're going to meet other gay, bi men in the program.

There's community calls, there's one-on-one calls, and you also have access to me whenever you need me, and I get back to you within 24 hours or by the next business day.

The reason that is is because, you know, I could teach you to swim by reading a book on the side of the pool, but if you never jump in the water, you're never going to learn how to swim.

So, the community calls help you to swim right? To put that into practice with other men. But also, you go out into the world and you you go on that date.

Like, we'll set you up for goals, and you're going to push yourself out of your comfort zone and do those things, and then you're going to come back to me or message me and let me know how that went.

So, you're getting out of the water to talk to me, and then you're going back in the water to do the thing.

And I always say that energy is transferable, so the relationships you're building with me and with the guys in the program directly relatable or very transferable to the relationships in your real life.

You know, I told you that, you know, so many men say that they're not Christian enough for Christians.

They're not gay enough for gay people. Here's a group of people that have burned, been burned in similar ways. And another thing you hear, Rob, often is that it's so easy for us to get notches on the belt.

I am very sex-positive. I don't, you know, that's another conversation. It's not about not having sex. It's about what happens, though, when we don't jump to using sex as a way of avoiding discomfort.

So, in this program, there's that container of we're getting to know each other on a much more vulnerable level.

And again, that'll give you confidence, and that's transferable to those other relationships.

So, I think that this is a much more wholehearted, whole body, whole brain, whole heart approach to healing.

Letting Go of Religious Shame (26:14)

Rob Loveless

That's awesome. And I love hearing the sex-positive note because I can imagine that going through this program, kind of a twofold thing as a compound layer with religion is, one, there tends to be shame with sexuality.

Just general sexuality from religion as a starter point. But two, being gay, there's that additional layer of shame within there. So, I think it's really important that that's addressed.

You know, part of the issue is a lot of gay men feel that they're alone when really, they're not alone. There's a lot of people like them out there in this situation.

So, what are some of maybe the more common scenarios you've seen of men who feel that they're alone, coming into this program and realizing they're not alone?

Eric Feltes

Yeah. People pleasing is a big one. That's why, y'all, if you sign up for our email list, the first email is a four-step guide to break free from your people-pleaser prisons. We have so many resources available.

So, there's people pleasing and there's perfectionism. There's there's shame around desire, right? We are taught to not desire. We are taught that we are bad for desiring what we desire.

And that is that, goes beyond sex. We live small. Like I didn't want to be an actor, right? Like I was wrong to want that. When I started my coaching business, I thought at the beginning, like, I can't make money.

That's not okay. So, we're taught to live very small, right? One of the first modules that you do with me, I call it, you know, the, you know, dare to desire.

It's get you out of your comfort zone and clarify what you want in your life. And it's very uncomfortable. It sounds simple. It's not. So that also, you know, like I said, people pleasing.

We live the life that other people want us to live. People pleasing. There's nothing wrong with pleasing others, but it becomes people-pleasing when you please others at your own expense, right?

So, how can we learn to take up the amount of space that straight, cisgender, white men have been afforded since the dawn of time, right? That's their privilege.

There's nothing wrong with that privilege, but it is what it is. So how can we take up the space that we want? And also, how can we set boundaries for when people push back on that?

People tell me often, you know, that their family or people in their life will say like, you've changed. Well, thank God they've changed because then I've done my job, right?

They're not living by your norms anymore. So yeah, I mean to answer your question in short, shame can show up and manifest in so many different arenas.

Other things is loneliness, not having friends, not having a community, not having gay again, healthy gay relationships outside of the notches on your belt. Or not having sex at all.

I have other men that it's like. I have some men that they're not ready to have sex. I have other men that, I had a client once, Rob.

He was 67 the first thing he said to me in the consultation was, I want to have sex. He had, I want to say, two children. He had an ex-wife. He had been divorced and out of the closet for six years.

Still never had sex with a man. Two weeks into the program, he had sex with a man. I remember when he said that to me, like, I want to have sex.

I thought, I was like, okay, well, this isn't like, I'm not a sex worker, so how am I going to make this? Not like there's nothing wrong with sex work. But I was like, how am I going to make this work?

And what we did was we set a plan together that that involved building his confidence, that involved getting out of his comfort zone, that involved figuring out clarifying his desires.

What kind of sex do you want? Things like that. Two weeks, two weeks into the program, he had sex for the first time. By the time the program was over, he was in his first relationship.

So, this stuff works. You just got to be willing to get out of your comfort zone.

You got to be willing to approach this with an open mind and an open heart, and you have to be willing to be committed, to commit to the process.

Rob Loveless

That's amazing. And I love that, being committed to the process, because, obviously, you know, it's kind of a daily thing.

You can't just show up once and then not do the homework and hope that everything just changes overnight. You have to continually put in the work.

So that being said, you know, from that 10-week program you have, do you have any other kind of success stories you like to talk about of people have gone through the program and have had, you know, great success afterwards?

And obviously, understand that we, you know, have to maintain confidentiality.

Eric Feltes

Sure. Yeah, yeah. Well, I'll also say, on top of the 10-week program, we have an ongoing leadership program where men who finish the work can continue the work to become leaders in the community.

To go off of that swimming metaphor, I say that the 10-week program teaches you how to swim, but the ongoing leadership program teaches you how to be an Olympic athlete.

So, you learn how to teach others how to swim. You learn how to swim with others.

You learn how to again, hold that endurance and really get the life that you want to continue that work to be, to become more of a leader. So other success stories, my gosh.

I mean, I am thinking of two clients who met in the program, and now they're in a relationship. One of them wasn't out to his family at all. Now he's fully out and in a relationship.

The other one struggled big time with with with confidence. I'm speaking a little vague because I do know that some people know them.

So, anything I've said so far is not, is not confidential, but, yeah, struggled with confidence and really loving himself deeply as he is.

And also struggled with breaking ties from, you know, organizations that that did not love and accept him as he, as he is. So, I'm thinking of them.

I'm thinking of a client who, you know, wanted to start his own business and was struggling financially. By the end of the program, he got a $50,000 grant for his program, for his, for his business.

I can't tell you how many people have started their own businesses through this work. There are so many potential leaders in the queer community. They just need to, again, it starts with daring to desire.

The number of people I could tell you that have, yeah, built their confidence, had sex for the first time, been in relationships for the first time.

Some of them have gone back to church because they were so burned before, but they wanted that. Some of them had the courage to leave church for the, you know, for the last time.

So, every journey is different, but it all involves becoming resilient of that shame, daring to desire, and daring to take up the space that we are worthy of taking up.

Episode Closing (32:31)

Rob Loveless

Amazing. I love that. So, this is, I mean, this is great work you're doing. And again, I know the podcast just came out. I'm super excited to see where it goes and keep listening to it.

So, for you, what does the future look like between your podcast and your life coaching? Where would you like to take it?

Eric Feltes

Oh, yeah, thank you. I love that question. The podcast is going to be a top-rated podcast. That's what I'm manifesting, as is, as is yours already.

So, yeah, I want to, I want, I want The Great Unbecoming to be a top-rated podcast. I want to, the program is already sustainable, but I want to continue to grow the program.

I want to eventually write my own book. I want to tour with the book that I've written.

I want to sell out arenas and be a speaker and reach wider audiences with the help of the book and the podcast and the program.

I've toyed, I've toyed around with the idea of coaching other queer coaches and kind of expanding Life Coaching By Feltes.

You know, I understand that I have limitations in my privilege as a white cisgender man, and that doesn't really relate to every single person that that that needs this work.

So, if I am ever able to, if I'm ever at a point where I can have the time and the resources to coach other coaches, other queer coaches, trans coaches, people of color, so that I can expand this work and reach more people, that's sort of in the back of my mind.

Maybe in, maybe five or 10 years down the road. So, there's a lot of fun stuff coming up. Right now, like you said, it's really is focused on podcast and I'm having so much fun doing that.

Rob Loveless

That's awesome. And I'll be sure to include all the links to all your stuff in here because everybody who's listening, please go check out Eric and all his work after this.

It's really great, beneficial information. So, I highly recommend.

And I guess as we're kind of getting towards the end here, for anyone who's considering working with you or a life coach, but maybe is hesitant and unsure and kind of maybe even a little fearful, what advice would you give them?

Eric Feltes

Yeah, I say that nothing is done without fear. So, if you are afraid, do your best to differentiate the voice of fear from the voice of God and worthiness.

You know it is possible that you are feeling afraid because you've never done this. That's it. Your body, dear listener, your body does not want healthy. Your body wants normal.

It wants to regulate what it's been doing your whole life. Is it possible that that voice of fear?

Is the same voice that kept you in the closet or is keeping you in the closet that's keeping you from living the life that you want?

So, if you're feeling a little stressed, a little bit of fear, I think that it's probably a sign that you're on the right track. What you can do is you can reach out to me. I'm on Instagram. Eric Feltes. E-R-I-C F-E-L-T-E-S.

And what you do is you just DM me the word help. That's it. That's all. You don't need to know words. All you need to know is one word. It's the word help. You can DM me the word help.

If you want to fast-track the process, what you can do is you can go on my Instagram. Again, E-R-I-C F-E-L-T-E-S, and the link in my bio, if you click on it, there's a link in that link tree that says, that's drumeo.

But either way, you click on the link in my bio, and there's a sub-link in there that says, Book A Free Discovery Call. You can click on that, you know, answer a couple of questions if you're ready for that.

And then we will have an hour-long free Zoom call face-to-face to figure out where you are and where you want to be and dig down into the how.

Into the how, I can help you, and then I can answer any questions that you might have about the program.

We can get you started that way. If you're not ready, that's okay, but here's the thing, you'll never be ready.

There's a million reasons not to live your best life, and has that been working for you so far?

And if not, when are you going to draw the line in the sand and take the step to live your best life and to unbecome that which no longer serves you?

Rob Loveless

I mean, it's scary to put in the work, but I mean that fear of going outside your comfort zone is what ultimately helps with growth.

And I think that ties back into the tarot card with The Hermit in reverse is that either we're spending too much time reflecting inwards or not enough time reflecting inwards because sometimes that looking inside and confronting what might actually be keeping us up at night can be scary.

But it's important to just kind of, you know, recognize that fear and welcome it, but don't let that hold you back from taking the next step to a happier, healthier future.

Eric Feltes

I was just thinking about what I said about drawing a line in the sand. That's exactly what The Hermit card is, right? Make a, make a change.

What's working for you right now isn't working. Or what's happening right now isn't working. So, draw a line in the sand and dig deep in. Or if you've already been digging so deep in, take the leap.

I love that, Rob, good connection.

Rob Loveless

Thank you. And you know, before we wrap up, is there anything we didn't cover that you'd like to, you know, include?

Eric Feltes

Yeah. I mean, the foundation of what Rob and I do is love. You know, everything comes from a place of fear or a place of love.

So, I'm confident saying, saying this is true for Rob as well. But you are always welcome in my space and Rob's space. We we love you and and love is an action. It's not a feeling, right?

So, we see you as you are. We, we embrace you as and because of who you are, not in spite of who you are. So, when in doubt, ask yourself, what is, where is the place of love? And let me follow that.

Connect with Eric (38:01)

Rob Loveless

Awesome. I love that. And, then you know, Eric, I know you already plugged your Instagram, but where else can people find you? Tell them all the things.

Eric Feltes

Yeah. So, it is Eric Feltes at Instagram. It's Eric.Feltes at TikTok. You can email me eric@lifecoachingbyfeltes.com.

You can go to www.lifecoachingbyfeltes.com. You can also search wherever you listen to podcasts The Great Unbecoming.

Rob Loveless

And definitely check it out. Like I said, I've listened to the first two episodes that have been out so far, and absolutely love it.

I think you know, for anybody who might come to this podcast trying to find ways to overcome shame and trauma, you know, this is an excellent additional podcast to listen to.

So, make sure you subscribe, check it out, and give him a follow on Instagram and TikTok.

Connect with A Jaded Gay (38:49)

Rob Loveless

Also, for our podcast, as you know, you can find A Jaded Gay on Instagram, TikTok, SoundCloud, and YouTube @ajadedgaypod.

You can contact me, rob@ajadedgay.com, with any feedback or questions about the episode. You can also follow me personally, rob_loveless, on Instagram.

And remember, every day is all we have, so you got to make your own happiness.

Mmm-bye.

Eric Feltes

Bye.